How original

[Tanktop]

Last night on WP3 it took a whole 10 seconds after seeing some pilots begin to chat in German for a UK pilot to start going on about the war.

What a surprise.

It wasn't done maliciously and it didn't go on for long, but why do it at all? It's all too easy for others to be associated with this kind of crap just by being in the same arena - please don't do it.

If you want to insult Germans go on about mullet haircuts or the Euro 2000 result or something.

Tanktop

[[TSQN] Fu11]

Originally posted by Tanktop
If you want to insult Germans go on about mullet haircuts or the Euro 2000 result or something.

you just go and contradict yourself, go on, see if we care :)

[Tanktop]

You just go on and miss the point, see if I care :)

C'mon Fu11, banter is one thing, bleating on about the war is something different, or don't you agree?

TT

[FlyinBrick]

Yeah I was in the other night with a load of Germans there, and someone called Mini started calling em nazi's etc.

Very sad, and very childish...grow up FFS!!!

[[TSQN]St Peter]

FB, check mini's apology post of yesterday.

[Hurricainey]

That was me! and I wasn't really mentioning the war I was simply quoting a line from Faulty Towers the one where he's trying to take an order for food and he can't stop mentioning the war and he says to Polly "don't mention the war, I mention it once but I think I got away with it" (one of the funniest moments in T.V. history).
I admit this was probably lost on them but I really don't think they were bothered. I played until everyone went and I had a bit of friendly chat with the Germans actually.

So do you still have a problem with this or what?

p.s. I never called them Nazi's and I mentioned the war once (but I obviously didn't get away with it!!! :) )

[Edited by Hurricainey on 03-10-2000 at 10:38 AM]

[[TSQN] Fu11]

why not talk about the war?

interesting subject and something that a lot of us find compelling towards the game.

:)

[Phillie Time]

FWIW we're part german (saxon) as a nation with a german monarchy :) And if it wasn't for some help we might well have lost the war...... nothing to show off about really.... also we as a nation are famous for being equally as bad if not worse than the 3rd reich.... so we're no angels ourselves.... these things are best left to history..
We only embarress ourselves by banging on about it....

But saying that abet the Germans take the mickey occasionally too...... :)

[Edited by Phillie Time on 03-10-2000 at 10:57 AM]

[Mebe]

Originally posted by Phillie Time
also we as a nation are famous for being equally as bad if not worse than the 3rd reich.... so we're no angels ourselves....

I hope I'm misunderstanding you Phillie, I really do. There is no way in hell you can compare our somewhat less than pleasant imperial past with what went on in the years prior to and during WW2.

Actually **** it I'm cross now, you can tell coz I'm ****ing causing the ****ing swear censor some work, please tell me you *don't* need a visit to one of the holocaust museums?

[TOTENKOPF]

I also witnessed some unpleasant remarks in WP3 last night.....as usual tho,only from 1 or 2 idiotic GB pilots.
The crux of their insults seemed to be based on the astonishing fact that the German pilots had the audacity to speak to each other in German.One moronic GB pilot kept making "Sun-reader" style "jokes" using comic-book German phrases which,for some reason,he obviously found funny but noone else did.Not only are people like him emabarrasing to us,but he also showed his astonishing ignorance by assuming that the German pilots didnt understand English.
Remember,their level of education is rather higher than ours(baesd only statistics I know,but how else can you judge?).Their knowledge of foreign languages is considerably better than the shameful attempts that we make to learn them.Really...the language joke is on us.
That said,the majority of the GB pilots showed respect and played with dignity.Im looking forward to playing against some new opponents...especially as they seem to be very good at AA(yeah...I got out-dogfought by a 109 again...sigh).
And btw...Phillie is absolutely right.....If you are not from a Celtic background then you are probably Anglo-saxon.
The Angles migrated to Angleland(England)...and where did they come from?....Germany.And where is Saxony?...Germany.I know that the Vikings also played a huge part in the populating of Britain....but dont forget....they are a Germanic(Teutonic) race as well.Much of our language is developed from Latin.Latin is almost identical to Old-German.
You see...we are not so different after all.

[Hurricainey]

Could anyone understand what they were saying in German????
Maybe they were slagging us off?
We'll never know.
Seriously though they seemed pleasant enough and thanked us for letting them play on Wireplay which was nice.


[Edited by Hurricainey on 03-10-2000 at 12:16 PM]

[SonicYoof]

bit less of the "them and us" pls eh

[[TSQN]St Peter]

Originally posted by Phillie Time
FWIW we're part german (saxon) as a nation with a german monarchy :)



Speak for yourself Phillie, I'm a Pict! :E

St.P

[Phillie Time]

Originally posted by Mebe
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Phillie Time
[B]also we as a nation are famous for being equally as bad if not worse than the 3rd reich.... so we're no angels ourselves....

Mebe calm down

Badly worded on my part.....

The actions of the british empire weren't on the scale of the holocaust (although over a longer time and in mmore places - do you know how many casualties we caused world wide - I bet you don't - I certainly don't know.... but you can imagine the scale considering the size of our empire back then. The 3rd Reich they got some of their ideas and inspiration from the british empire without a doubt - we invented concentration camps in south africa - we ran india with an iron fist for so many years. We didn't adopt an empire - we stole it with the gun and the sword. A tiny North atlantic island does not run half the planet with good will alone m8. Hardly the actions an innocent country. And just cause the Holocaust happened does not make it OK for all the other countries that made similar mistakes - all be it on a smaller scale. We have all made mistakes.

My point is that our history is not unblemished - neither are most countries.... so most history should be left where it is and let us all look forward rather than back.

I have no wish to belittle the suffering of the jews during the 2nd world war.

i think the saying I'm looking for is "People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones"

[Phillie Time]

BTW - i don't *need* to go to one of those Holocaust Museums........ I'm far from ignorant on the subject.

[Mebe]

Phillie, there is a world of difference and you know it.

Badly worded doesnt cover half if it. Yes we were all bad in the 18th and 19th centuries, but the scale of badness is dwarfed by cold calculated deliberate evil:

Very approximate figures for deliberate killings of non combatants in this century:

Stalin 20Million
Hitler 15Million
Mao 15Million

Remember these are civilian deaths (Hitler wins if you chuck in all the armed forces deaths)

Your first post, and your second post have a sort of "hey its OK, yeah they were bad but we were all bad so lets kinda forget about it shall we" feel.

[Phillie Time]

[Edited by Phillie Time on 03-10-2000 at 01:08 PM]

[Mebe]

BTW, concentration camps were invented by the british.... as a way of protecting the non Boer settlers in South Africa... they simply couldnt protect all the isolated farmsteads so they gathered them together into camps.

Problem was disease became rife.

The original concentration camp was invented for a reasonable purpose.

[Phillie Time]

Originally posted by Mebe

Your first post, and your second post have a sort of "hey its OK, yeah they were bad but we were all bad so lets kinda forget about it shall we" feel.


Eeeerm yeah... that's the long and short of it really....

[Phillie Time]

the alternative being ????

[Mebe]

So the following estimates for actual murders (shooting, gassing, hanging etc) of civilians are directly comparable and of no greater significance than the imperialistic occupation of undeveloped countries by most European nations during the 18th & 19th century.

Rummel: 20,946,000 democides
Brzezinski: 17,000,000
Urlanis: 15-16,000,000 (11-12M civilians + 3.9M POWs)
Our Times: 13,000,000 (6M Jews + 7M others)
Compton's: 12,000,000
Grenville: 10,000,000, including 2M children.
NOTE: These numbers only include outright murders, but keep in mind that some 18M civilians and 17M soldiers died in the European War. That's 35,000,000 deaths which can probably be blamed on Hitler to one extent or another.

I think you have smoked one too many Phillie.
Where is the :disgusted: symbol?

[Mebe]

Originally posted by Phillie Time
the alternative being ????

The alternative is not to decrease the atrocity of what was commited by comparing it with lesser 'bad things'.

Mebe: You spilt my pint
Phillie: Uh sorry m8
Mebe: No worries, I burned down your house, tortured and murdered you relatives. But hey, we both did bad things.

[334th Lenagh]

For everyones information.

All players are being monitored heavily at the moment with the launch of WP3.

I have advised all admins that any racist remarks to foreign players or likewise from foreign players to UK players result in the immediate removal of the offender from the arena and reports sent to the relevant people for further action to be taken.

We are still called tommies by the germans and they don't mind being called jerry but use your common sense about what is a joke and what is offensive.

I would assume that you will not be asked to explain your actions you will just be removed.

Len

[Phillie Time]

So you're saying the way we treated ppl was right then r u ???????

:disgusted:

[Mebe]

Absolutely not. We've killed people left right and center, from Amritsar to Bloody Sunday but I'm struggling to find instances of premeditated, institutionalised, systematic slaughter.

There are magnitudes of 'bad', there have to be otherwise getting caught for speeding would be a similar crime to that of Myra Hindley.

Is there *no* difference to you?

[Phillie Time]

What do you think Mebe..... ffs

[Hazlo]

Perhaps we should get to know the foreign players before having jokes about what is obviously a sensitive subject.

You wouldn't go up to a German who you didnt know and crack jokes about the war would you? No. So get to know them first and when they feel comfortable with being here and know that there's no malice in any banter then perhaps any sensitive subject banter can be taken in the spirit intended.

I will be taking action against ANY player that steps over the mark from ANY country.

You have been warned.Keep it civil.

[Mebe]

I'm sorry if my examples are too extreme for you m8 (I know you dont believe Speeding & killing children to be equvalent), but they have to be pretty extreme to be in the same sort of style as your "also we as a nation are famous for being equally as bad if not worse than the 3rd reich.... so we're no angels ourselves...."

I suspect your statement might cause *just* a little offence around most people who fought in or lived through the war.

[kipp]

Oh ****, thats funny, lets all play WW2 flight sim but were not allowed to mention WW2?

Come on, where all thinking reasoning people, there was a war, ignoring it isnt going to make it go away, however its more than likely that other nations playing AA bare you no manevolance whatsoever and are just after having a bit of laugh.

I am not responsible for my ancestors and they aint responsible for theirs, everyones an individual and has the right to be treated with respect.

So play nicely children, no matter if you do speak with a funny accent ( Yes i do mean you Cobra ;o)

[Marky B]

.

[Phillie Time]

FFS !!!!!!!!!

I'm sure ppl who have any bad experience of the British will be offended by your flippant lack of any remorse for your countries acts...... all based on another country being *worse*.... and other counrties doing it too (this is the argement alot of brits always use)

I know 2 wrongs don't make a right - I never said it did - did I - I said I worded the sentence above badly - so FFS stop quoting it as your prize trophy exhibit here.... if I wrote the post again I'd have worded it differently FFS - I said that as soon as you pointed out the mistake FFS !!!!!!

STOP GOING ON ABOUT IT !!!!!!!!!

The point I am making is still the same....

[Phillie Time]

Originally posted by kipp
I am not responsible for my ancestors and they aint responsible for theirs, everyones an individual and has the right to be treated with respect.




Exactly :)

[Macwedd]

right back to the subject in hand........

anyone (GE or UK) throwing racial aduse round in the arena will simply be suspended tis that simple people. In the first case for a day and for a repeat offence an unlimited suspension. We do not tolerate racial abuse is real life and I will not tolerate it AA either.

So if you have a problem playing with people from another race/cread/colour ****off and play somewhere else coz you ain't welcome here.

[Mebe]

Originally posted by Phillie Time
The point I am making is still the same....


And still one I disagree with. Final words then:

I've acknowledged this countries less than lillywhite past (I even named a couple of incidents) so how you can accuse me of a 'flippant lack of any remorse' is remarkable.

My whole problem is with what I percieve as your "lets forget one really bad thing because we also did some bad things.

We should forget neither, since forgetting opens the door to repeating. Neither should we be ashamed or afraid to discuss what happened without trying to lessen it or mitigate it, either by comparison, or by rewriting or by sheer familiarity.

History doesn't change, but its dangerously easy to change peoples interpretation of it.

----- End of my side of the disucssion, I enjoyed disagreeing with you ---------

On the other subject, we should definitely keep any kind attempted humour or banter re: WWx out of AA. Its far to easy to insult people you don't know. Even if you *do* get to know someone and feel you can banter with them you should still keep that sort of banter out of AA, it will either offend someone you dont know who is listening or give the wrong impression to GB AA people of how to behave.

[Mebe]

errr Mac, are Germans a different 'Race' or just a different nation :-p

[Dragonweedy]

Does anyone know the correct wording of that quotation from the late ArchBishop (it was him, wasn't it?), who said;

"I have been cursed with the ability to sympathise with both sides of almost any argument"

Anyhow, that's roughly how I feel about the Mebe/Phillie ping-pong match. I do feel that both have expressed admirable concern and awareness of the lessons to be learned from History. For that is the purpose of History isn't it? Another famous quote from someone or other goes something like "Those who remain ignorant of History are doomed to repeat it".

You can tell I'm not working from a text-book can't you!

Put in Flippant-Munky-Speak; "If you know which skeleton was in the other man's closet, then he may know where you buried your mother-in-law. It is sometimes better to let the children play on the swings together, then tell them about the dangers later. The Lion and the Elephant can both kill a gazelle, choosing not to, does not make them any less dangerous. Putting sensible posts on an open noticeboard is often an invitation to stupid people to waste everyone's time with their own selfish self aggrandisement. Comedy Munks should avoid jumping into serious issues without engaging what's left of their brain..."


Excuse me, I'll just get my robe.... :emb:

[[jedi] GOD]

Agreed mac m8. racial abuse in life is hard enough .... dont bring it into a peacefull society [so to speak even tho we all play a war game :)] it is not needed and more to the point it is wrong. As mac said if ure not gonna be fair and play without having to insult someone then F*** OFF you are not needed.

[Phillie Time]

Mebe

I'm not saying "forget it all happened", only a fool would ignore the lessons of history.

Man's advancement is based on learning from mistakes..... we'd still be what ever we were before being what we are now if we didn't (make sense of that !!!)
The phrase used above "let's forget it" I meant as it's used in common speach quite often - meaning : lets let it lie, or lets move on from this subject, lets not discuss it - not literally meaning "to attempt to remove the event from memory altogether".




As you say:

we should definitely keep any kind attempted humour or banter re: WWx out of AA. Its far to easy to insult people you don't know. Even if you *do* get to know someone and feel you can banter with them you should still keep that sort of banter out of AA, it will either offend someone you dont know who is listening or give the wrong impression to GB AA people of how to behave.

[TOTENKOPF]

Interesting thread this...from a historical point of view anyway.
The fact is,history depends on your geographical point of view....or I should say,the historical "spin" that any given country puts on its' own view of history.Most countries prefer to see themselves in a good light....but unfortunately,I cannot think of ONE country that hasnt committed atrocities of one kind or another at some time.Then it comes down to "well,they committed more atrocities than us..therefore we are best"...which is nonsense of course.
Lets assume that Hitler had one....after the war had finished there would inevitably have been war crimes trials...except,this time it would not have been the Nazis on trial...but people like Arthur Harris etc..and indeed,Churchill himself.Why?..the Nazis would have pointed out that the bombing of Dresden(and similar cities/towns) was nothing more than a deliberate attempt to demoralise German civilians(which,icidentally,was Harris stated objective) and therefore under the terms of the Geneva convention...a war crime.We now,of course,do our best to justify our own acts of barbarism.
History is full of unspeakable horrors committed by one side against another....and noone is blameless.But,as George Bernard Shaw said"Strange how there are never any war criminals on the the winning side".
Britain did indeed invent the concept of the concentration camp...against the Boers...and if my memory is correct, about 8000 men,women and children were starved to death as a result.I know that doesnt compare numeraically with the evil that Hitler committed...but it has the same intent.
History,however warped by prejudice,should at least teach us valuable lessons about co-habiting with other cultures....and until the world learns this,I doubt we have the right to refer to ourselves as "civilised".We are getting there...but painfully slowly.Rasiscm is one of the many blocks to human progress.
Back on subject.....thanks for that comment Mac...its reassuring that there will be a measure of control in the arenas...it will make it much more enjoyable for the majority of players.

[TK421]

my cat's breath smells of cat food

[Mebe]

OK Phillie, we seem to have reached a middle ground of sorts :)

On the subject of Camps though Totenkopf, there is no evidence that the camps were set up with the intention of killing or causing suffering (other than emotional I guess).

Whilst it it true to say that the mortality rate for a period was astonishingly high "...at least twenty thousand whites and twelve thousand coloured people had died in the concentration camps, the majority from epidemics of measles and typhoid" in 10 months. There was no suggestion that the camps were set up with the intention of killing people.

'....During this same time, though, Spies writes, "There can be little doubt that Milner and Chamberlain were responsible for injecting the administrative staff of the camps with this sense of urgency" [after the camps were transferred to civilian control in November 1901]. Both the secretary of state and the high commisioner had become extremely concerned about conditions in the concentration camps, and about the consequent unfavorable publicity. Their correspondence shows concern with all aspects of camp administration including such matters as the availability of milk and the nutritional value of rations; remarkable concerns for two of the most prominent figures of the Empire. [Cd. 902] Chamberlain, in the first week of November, impressed upon Brodrick (secretary of war) how serious the matter was . . ." (4) And Chamberlain soon thereafter placed a call for medical officers for the camps and, somewhat later, additional nurses. '

Yes the camps were badly run and the people in them suffered considerably from disease before the situation was rectified. Even the Boers had confused views about the camps:

"...What then were the facts of British policy towards Boer and African civilians during the Boer War of 1899-1902 that leading Boers can complain, in May 1902 (during the meeting of Boer delegates at Vereeninging to negotiate a peace settlement), that the British no longer would take their women and children in to the concentartion camps?..."

The truth is, that despite sharing the same name, the camps were not the same at all.

All the above material from http://www-sul.stanford.edu/depts/ssrg/africa/boers.html

Interesting if you can be bothered wading though all the quotations and references.

[Mebe]

Oh and BTW, you are right about Harris. There is a strong argument that he and others should have been tried for war crimes.

[Marg]

i think phillies original point was one of we shouldnt gloat about winning the war, since really there are no winners. and i think that if for any reason, ppl shouldnt gloat about winning the war anyway, not beacuse it might offend someone, but why should u glorify killing?

personally i think "who did what and in what magnitude" has no real meaning. didnt stalin say, "when you kill one man, its a tradgedy, when you kill 1 million, it is a statistic" or something like that. whether one person died, or 1 million died, i still think its wrong. you are still a murderer, why should there be some sort of number whereby suddenly its genocide? spilling a pint? murdering relatives? totally different. sure u can have magnitudes of *bad* but i think the lines are *very* fine, if indeed there are any, when it comes to killing. what is the definition of a *bad* war? when more people die than ever before? when the methods of killing are peculuar or unusual? when someone dies in a gas chamber, or lies in agony on a battlefield for hours? whats the definition of a *bad* way to die? is there a *good* way to die?
equally, why blame a mans/nations decendents for something it did in the past. remembering things is a good way to prevent things happening again in the future. sometimes though, memories instigate events that we dont particularly want to happen. Rwanda, uganda, yugoslavia.. all modern day mass genocide, likened to nazi ethnic cleansing. memories play an important part, not only in giving them ideas on how to solve the problem, but they also give them the hate in the 1st place.

anyway, as usual, im rambling. but to sum it up, i think its the most rediculous thing in the world to argue about why its ok to kill in one way, but not another.

[Edited by Marg on 03-10-2000 at 03:55 PM]

[Marg]

damn im slow, took me a hour to write that. u lot post to much in a hour.

[Hurricainey]

OK things are getting way out of control here. Why is it these threads go off on such a tangent. From someone complaining about a bit of banter on AA to War atrocities.

[Cooger]

can i just say... germans are great people once u start chatting to them.... tbh i have np with them at all and have fun with them in WP3... but on saying that they also have those *Few* idiots that fly around making arses of them selves as we do .... and i met one the other day... he made alot of people leave teh arena including me and dilly.. and all i asked was that he didnt runway so much becuase not all UK people like it.... he then replied in german some stuff which made other germans laugh.. then continued to call me names which inturn made me call for an admin once i said an adin was on there way he stoppped hurling abuse and continued saying for me to chill and stop being racist <--- WTF ?

anyway IJ came in and the atmosphere became ok to play in... but its just thoughs few idiots that give each Nat a bad rep in some cases....

[TOTENKOPF]

Mebe,I bow to your obvoiusly greater knowledge of that part of history....tho I did put the rider "if my memory is correct" just to cover myself...lol.Also thanks for the link to more info on the subject,I have saved that and will be looking at it later.
My information came,I admit,from one part of a TV documentary about the Boer War(on Discovery i think)....just goes to show how dangerous a small amount of knowledge about an important subject can be,and how selective historical memory can catch us all out....me this time.

[Mebe]

Good points Marg, slightly off the track we took but valid nonetheless. However if you take your argument to extremes we should have lined up at Dover to hand over our weapons to each and every attempted invader because to do otherwise would involve killing and would be wrong. Philosophy. Pah. I'm far to sober for Philosophy.
:)

[Mebe]

Originally posted by TOTENKOPF
Mebe,I bow to your obvoiusly greater knowledge of that part of history

hehe naahh m8, I just have some good search tools here at work :)

['Johnnie' Johnson]

I don't know a great deal about the Boer War, but I've a friend at the National Army Museum who does. Apparently the camps in South Africa were out 'up-country' and in order to run properly needed a continuous delivery of supplies. No surprise there.

The main way of delivering these supplies was via the railways. You may have seen photos of British armoured trains from this period.

The Boers waged a guerilla war against the British. A prime target for such an approach because it is so difficult to defend and yet so easy to damage is the railway. The same railway that was resupplying British troops was also supplying the camps. You can see where this is leading.

This isn't an attempt to pin blame or take sides, just reporting the 'facts' as reported to me.

[Marg]

However if you take your argument to extremes we should have lined up at Dover to hand over our weapons to each and every attempted invader because to do otherwise would involve killing and would be wrong

true, but if *everyone* believed killing was wrong, would there be a need for armies? weapons? etc. idealistic to the extreme.

[Dragonweedy]

Originally posted by Marg
remembering things is a good way to prevent things happening again in the future. sometimes though, memories instigate events that we dont particularly want to happen. Rwanda, uganda, yugoslavia.. all modern day mass genocide, likened to nazi ethnic cleansing. memories play an important part, not only in giving them ideas on how to solve the problem, but they also give them the hate in the 1st place.

[Edited by Marg on 03-10-2000 at 03:55 PM]

I have a feeling that a few people may have skipped over this bit towards the end of Marg's post. But I think it is an astute observation and well worth repeating.

Oh and BTW, sorry for my flippant interjection earlier. As a matter of fact, I really enjoyed reading this most illuminating thread despite my earlier comments. Keep up the good work chaps...

[Mebe]

I hate reading to then end of Marg's posts coz for a snot nosed barely grown up half yank he sometimes makes a lot of sense.... and I can't be coping with that.

:)

[Dark Dave]

Originally posted by Marg

true, but if *everyone* believed killing was wrong, would there be a need for armies? weapons? etc. idealistic to the extreme.

Exactly Marg, the liberal arguement only works because they assume everyone thinks the same way as them - which isn`t the case and never will be, therefor their arguements are pointless.

Britain could only do what it thought was right at the time of ww2, maybe after the event people can claim if they`d done a bit of this and a bit of something else differently that things would have turned out better, but at the time you can only do what you think is 'right' . This is why it`s wrong to judge History by 21st century morals, what was considered 'right' or fair by people 200 years ago was different to now. They didn`t have the advantage of looking at things from each different point of view and Hindsight like we do - so who are we to say if in the same situations we wouldn`t have done the same.

And I think racism is a far over used word these days, seems to describe 'any' kind of disagreement between people of a different Nationality or Colour.

[WPS]

My cats arse smells of cat ****.

[Dark Dave]

Hardly supprising really

[TKFM_Maverick]

Here's an idea how about having the CoC in german and english. During the next few months i can see that alot of germans will play on our server so it may be wise.


I have nowt against germans. I work with loads of them and generally they are as nice as the english.


Has the admin functions of WP3 been improved?

So if you kick someone they stay kicked even if they try to rejoin with a diff nick in aa??


Loads of new people ---------> BIGGER MONK PILL

[TKFM] Maverick
[SW-CsR]Maverick
SW_Cameron (SW clan XO Diablo 2)

p.s. Can we recruit other nats into our squads??

When will the pa's be up in WP3???

____________________________________
OOOOOOOOooooooHHHHHHHHHHHhhhhhhhMMMMMMMMMMmmmmmmmmmmmm



[Edited by TKFM_Maverick on 04-10-2000 at 03:23 PM]

[Cobras_Babsack]

Hi friends,
i´m a german AA player and reading the first time here in your Community. It is very interesting to see that your opinion about the history of our nations principly are the same. Every take some mistakes.

So, i´m from the after war generation born 1967 and i can not accept what was going on at 39-45 and i ask my father why nobody has stopped this AH. My farther told me that the most germans was not realized 100% what is going on and the propaganda was so hard that everybody who go contra the regime will be murderd.
Sure this is not a excuse ( by the way sorry for my bad english) and i think there are now going 50 years after this and our countries make good buisenes and friendships and many germans married british people and backways, british people come to germany and work at many different jobs and also germans went to England and do the same.

Now at the 21 century Germany has a Problem with the goverment which is not hard enough to catch and stopp this young nazis in our country. It results out from the bad System in our school their are too many teachers with out a hard hand to told our childs that this part of germanys history was the badest thing what happends over the world for the last 1000 jears. No they tell our childs how dangerous is the atomreaktor or how many CO2 will be produced at a car and how many flowers will died if they play football.

This children come up to teenager and they has no idea what is giong on at 1940 and they like to play WAR but not realized what they do and fell as a big man wich has killed virtuall 1000 GB´s or US´s or anyones.

I think it is time to stopp those ones and if your System Administrator see any german player here and this speak naziegerman please kick them and send him a trojaner and crack him and ......

I can not believe that after our history that a guy with only 16 years speak about this war. Please kicked him out of this game.

This week some stupid germans attack a jewish Synagoge at Düsseldorf. Now we need to say sorry again for them and it will be never stopped. We payed million over million marks for our great mistake at the WW2, but i was not born at this time, and the kids which has attck this week the Synagoge too. But we will payed for it again, only why our Goverment is not able to stopp rasissm at ou country.

S O R R Y

[Dave B]

FFS, why is this poor sod having to say sorry?

Ive worked in Germany and played a great deal on German AA, they are a sound bunch of peeps, always made me feel welcome, went out of the way to translate any German into English for me, I'd swap any of them for some of the muppets we get on our AA.

If I see any bugger giving these lads a hard time, then they will have me to deal with also.

Dave B :(

[Dragonweedy]

Welcome Cobras_Babsack.

Do you know the British comedian Harry Enfield? He seems to know you :)

[Cobras_Babsack]

No sorry i do not known him.

I wrote this posting because i am very upset about some people from germany. that is the reason and i hope that all british AA friends see that we germans are not rasissm and like to play a game with you egal we have such a sh.. history.

Today is Today, we do not forget yesturday but we need to stop people who heroism the 3.reich all over the world.

[Chadman]

As with any country, there are always idiots that seek to ruin wot has been built.

I know many germans, thro Air Attack and Tribes. There hasnt been one I dont like...

WW2 is in the past, its history..it is OUR responsibility to make sure that we have learned the lessons from that time.

Those who ignore history, are doomed to repeat it

Not sure who quoted that, but I think it is applicable.

[Hazlo]

Any people who wish to spoil the game for others by way of racism, swearing, or breaching the Code of Conduct etc, will be dealt with in an appropriate manner.

You can be rest assured that the admins will do their best to ensure a pleasant atmosphere for everyone.

Thank you.

[Chadman]

The best way to ensure the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing

Edmund Burke.


Good quote....makes yer think dont it

[thanatos]

Ive seen this old chestnut about Britian inventing concentration camps on everything from the net to TV
so can we clarify what these camps actually where...

These camps where designed to isolate Boer populations under British control in order to make them easier to control..."concentrate" them in one area, hence the name. These were not death factories like in WW2 - please dont think Britian had camps like Auschwitz during the Boer War its complete bollox....

[[TSQN] Fu11]

s'not like we can "undo" the past atrocities and events.

we can however, stop dredging them up over somewhat unrelated threads? :E

cracking debate though mind you, a pleasure to read intelligent debating once every now and then, rather than the usual "YOU SUXOR!" "****AH!" and so forth..

:)