Merchant Problems

[Ceorlas]

Someone has been busy in Mithlond .. no more strange floaty rocks and lumps of ground in the sky and in tree-tops. Very nice.
Even nicer .. we have a new weapon vendor!
Now what could be nicer than all of that?

Hmm ...
1) Can we decide if his name is Belgath ..O or is it Belgath .. OL?
2) Can we have his sales dialogue/display stay open until we have finished our purchasing instead of it shutting down 3 seconds after being opened ?

Here's hoping a trip to Mithlond is going to be worth the travelling

[DM_Eönwë]

Due a misstake of mine I mixed up the names :-D Originally it was Belegathol, I will check everything and fix it.
What do you mean with the dialogue? Usually you select 'open store' and then the dialogue closes and the shop opens.

[MilouOpo]

What Ceorlas means is that Mithlond vendor will close his shop after said three seconds.

Not much time to look at his wares there..

[Ceorlas]

Yup, it is not all that easy to keep track of names, spellings etc between different parts of scripts etc

Select : From the vendor dialogue :- "Let me see your wares" or similar
Result : The ' shop ' opens and then immediately closes again .. you get a glimpse of his armour page and *boomp* .. back to a view of your own inventory

[DM_Eönwë]

I will check that.

[Mentat]

@Eonwe:

First of all "Kudos" Sir, for constantly putting work into the module, and especially to the shops. Thumbs up for the Mithlond store, may it still be restrained for the nimble handed.
I do have a few item suggestions, if you don't mind.

a.) Elven weapons need to be looked at and improved, since as it is now, they do not offer anything but a weightreduction, and are not used at all. Dwarven and Gondorian weapons, greatly outclass the eldar stock of weaponry, but why?

b.) Most elven weapons would deserve a damage bonus of some kind, since we can asume that their smithing abilities are nearly equal to those of the dwarves. Though for sure they would focus on lighter weapons and armor.
E.g.:

Sword(Imladris Longsword, given one has at least the Glorfindel token):
Improved elven Longsword: AB +1, damage 1d8, weightreduction, +2 slash damage
Masterwork elven Longsword: AB +2, damage 1d8, weightreduction, +3 slash damage
Expert/Artisan elven Longsword: AB +3, damage 1d8, weightreduction, +4 slash damage

Shield(Mithlond shield):
Improved elven shield: AC +1, weightreduction
Masterwork elven shield: AC +2, weightreduction
Expert/Artisan elven shield: AC +3, weightreduction

Armor(mithlond scalemail AC4, Dex Bonus 4, etc.):
Improved elven scalemail: AC +1, weightreduction
Masterwork elven scalemail: AC +2, weightreduction
Expert/Artisan elven scalemail: AC +3, weightreduction

And finally the Mithril Scimitar (If we want to keep Mithril weapons as buyable objects would be another question!):
Improved Mihtril Scimitar: AB +1, damage 1d6, weightreduction, +1 piercing damage, keen.
Masterwork Mihtril Scimitar: AB +2, damage 1d6, weightreduction, +2 piercing damage, keen.
Expert/Artisan Mihtril Scimitar: AB +3, damage 1d6, weightreduction, +3 piercing damage, keen.

Sounds overpowered, then reduce the boni. But if its really a Mithril weapon, I wouldn't say so!

The Expert/Artisan Mithril weapon should not be sold at all of course. Prices should be outrageous for all elven items, but especially for mithril weapons!

c.) One more point would be those new bracers from Mithlond:
Mithlond bracers of prowess: AC+1, +5 Parry, +5 Discipline.
Those look and sound really nice, but are totally useless. The AC Bonus won't stack, and the +5 parry is nice, but parry doesn't really work as we all know.
My suggestion would be:
Mithlond bracers of prowess: Dex+2, +5 Discipline, +5 Concentrate or Tumble.

d.) On spears: Since those are much less powerful then halberds etc. and count as two handed weapons, they should have an AC Bonus that makes them worth using.
e.g.
Improved Rohirrim spear: AC +2, Dmg 1d8, massive criticals 1d4
Masterwork Rohirrim spear: AC +3, Dmg 1d8, massive criticals 1d4
Expert/Artisan Rohirrim spear: AC +4, Dmg 1d8, massive criticals 1d4

[DM_Eönwë]

Many thanks, Mentat, for your input, though most of it is obsolete, since I worked out a new version of the item guideline. I will replace most items that are currently in stores, with different, more useful and more balanced versions. Furthermore, there will be for ALL items five different levels. Besides changing the standard items, there will be regionalized items too. I do not want to tell you too much, but just as an example, Elven weapons will have a small magical damage bonus versus Orcs, as do have Dwarven weapons too, but not magical but the same kind of the weapon's base damage kind. Dwarves will have the only available full plates! and there will be a larger range of items which gives boni on stats, e.g. Dwarven Boots (+CON), Elven Shoes (+DEX), etc. There will be regionalized items for Hobbit, Dwarven, Elven, Gondorian, Rohirrim, Haradrim, Isengard and Mordor. These items will of course refelect the local preference for weapons and armours, and of course also the 'magical' bonus will refelect it.
Real magical items, will only be available by questing! I will add a slection of items on each quest! And of course you also acn find magical items in loots. A new kind of items will be also introduced within the upcoming update: artifacts! These items are extrem powerful (they can have feats!), but are also extrem rare and hard to get. (the first ones will be in dragon lairs :-P ).
I also will include some role-play items, like new variations of tents, empty bottles, more food, etc. I also will include a pen and paper writing system, but you'll see :-D
All in all, I will completely change the items system as it is at the moment. So stay tuned and report any wishes and suggestions, so that I can include it.
Since my PC runs now (again on Windows... stupid toolset on Linux), I will fix some minor bugs and release version 1.3.2 this eve. (NO NEW HAK IS NEEDED!).

Since we cannot exchange all items that are already on characters, we will encourage to start a new character by special DMR's and of course, in time the old versions will vanish.

And now some comments to your post :-)

a.) Elven weapons need to be looked at and improved, since as it is now, they do not offer anything but a weightreduction, and are not used at all. Dwarven and Gondorian weapons, greatly outclass the eldar stock of weaponry, but why?

Solved! All regions will have special boni.

b.) Most elven weapons would deserve a damage bonus of some kind, since we can asume that their smithing abilities are nearly equal to those of the dwarves. Though for sure they would focus on lighter weapons and armor.

Elves will have a selection of weapons which fits to them and deals magical damage bonus to orcs. (IIRC longsword, scimitar, rapier, shortsword, longbow, and one or two more, but I can't recall right now.)

And finally the Mithril Scimitar (If we want to keep Mithril weapons as buyable objects would be another question!):

The mithril scimitars are a way too powerful and it seems to me that it doesn't fit to the setting. Mithril is EXTREMELY rare (even rarer than in the 2nd age) and so it wouldn't be sold. Such weapons are QUEST and LOOT only in the future. (also the stats would be appropriate for low level quest rewards, but you'll see soon in the new item guide.)

c.) One more point would be those new bracers from Mithlond:
Mithlond bracers of prowess: AC+1, +5 Parry, +5 Discipline.
Those look and sound really nice, but are totally useless. The AC Bonus won't stack, and the +5 parry is nice, but parry doesn't really work as we all know.

Such items won't be available in shoppes anymore. I will replace such items with more useful and more generic versions. Another version of "Bracers of Mithlond" could be a quest reward item, though.

d.) On spears: Since those are much less powerful then halberds etc. and count as two handed weapons, they should have an AC Bonus that makes them worth using.

I haven't worked out a different bonus for spears and helbards, but just keep in mind that two-handed weapons gets x1.5 Str-modifier!

[Mentat]

Sounds very good to me!

[DM_Eönwë]

Update :-D

[Mentat]

Update :-D

Are you sure that update worked Eonwe?
I just visited Mithlond, but the store hasn't changed. It still closes after 1,7 seconds, and the items are the same then before.

I haven't worked out a different bonus for spears and helbards, but just keep in mind that two-handed weapons gets x1.5 Str-modifier!

Well I was only referring to spears, helbards are fine as they are imho. The spear does considerable less damage then other two handed weapons, though it would be worth adding some AC bonus to them, as to reflect their advantage against mounted attacks, aswell their superior range used on a mount. Nobody can use a helbard on a horse or a twohanded sword, but a spear or polearm, thats quite different.

Rohirrim spears have some light AC bonus against evil, but the bonus should be a bit higher, and not only against evil ....

Really looking forward for that new item system. Cheers!

[DM_Eönwë]

I haven't updated the module, but my previous post ;-)

For the spears it is difficult to work out a balanced bonus, since an AC bonus will be completly useless, for they do not stack with rings, bracers and cloaks. I would rather use the quest items and artifacts to enpower such rare items by adding really damn good versions with those items as base items.
The same problem counts for heavy cross-bows as well :-(

[Eqvinox]

I myself would really love to see some useful spears, particularily because it's the best two hander you can get with certain classes, and despite it's low 1d8 damage i still find them quite decent.

I'll give a try on suggesting some interesting abilities for a spear [but not only], DM Eonwe. Maybe you'll find something that fits your concept.

Have you considered adding bonus feats to the weapons, like:

Bonus Feat: Expertise, Mounted Combat, Improved Parry [rapier], Cleave and/or Power Attack [greatsword, greataxe], Rapid Reload [dwarven xbow], Sneak Attack 1d6 [interesting thing for an elven bow, though a bit high on lvl requirement], Dirty Fighting [assassin's dagger], Deflect Arrows [tower shield], Increased Multiplier [indirect damage increase], Knockdown [maul]...

[DM_Eönwë]

Very nice idea, but in my opinion feats on standard weapons are a bit too powerful. Only rare artifacts on higher levels will have feats. Furthermore, a problem is that if you give standard spear a decent bonus, the weapon will become too expensive to be considered as 'standard'. Even now the new regionalized items will be quiet expensive which such low boni as damabe bonus on racial foes.
For the AC bonus on weapons, I think it's more a less totally useless, since it will not stack with AC bonus from ring, cloak and/or bracers.
BUT there already is a bonus for Rohirrim spears! (Well, not now, but within the updated version 1.4 :-D)

[vulpex]

This is an aside, but polearms have been used mounted. In japan naginata was not atypical, even if yari was favoured. Then it is open to interpretation if it is more like spear than balberd anyway. But of spears, one of most important weapons in human history, given short hand in DnD, and specially NwN. Added ac makes in its way sense, it is very defensive weapon in its usage in military. It could be dodge, which stacks....

[DM_Eönwë]

You cannot choose which kind of AC bonus you put on an item. It's hard-coded.

[DM_Roäc]

You could set an AC increase as an OnEquip script, possibly? Messy, but may work (far as I know).

[DM_Eönwë]

Definitivly no option.

[Silverleaf]

You cannot choose which kind of AC bonus you put on an item. It's hard-coded.

Really? I thought you could change that using the baseitems.2da. I could be wrong, but I thought you could set the type of AC bonus a specific item receives under the "AC Enchant" subcategory.

[MilouOpo]

This is an aside, but polearms have been used mounted. In japan naginata was not atypical, even if yari was favoured. Then it is open to interpretation if it is more like spear than balberd anyway. But of spears, one of most important weapons in human history, given short hand in DnD, and specially NwN. Added ac makes in its way sense, it is very defensive weapon in its usage in military. It could be dodge, which stacks....

On a quick glance spears might perhaps give dodge feat (which stacks) not the perfect solution, but something..

[Eqvinox]

For the AC bonus on spears, i'd opt for the Bonus Feat: Expertise over Dodge, and here's why.

Specifics: A character with this feat can make defensive attacks, gaining a +5 bonus to AC but receiving a -5 penalty to Attack Rolls.

The spear is rather a defensive weapon, and a typical spear is much longer than the NWN one. It would be difficult to perform dodging moves wielding this weapon in reality, also the long pole might make combat a bit tricky [what if the opponent reduces his range to you?] therefore making it difficult to strike, while gaining some range advantage over your opponent and keeping him at distance.
It makes sense to me that fighting with a spear would grant some AC at the cost of AB.
What do you think ?

[kittydragon]

For the AC bonus on spears, i'd opt for the Bonus Feat: Expertise over Dodge, and here's why.
(... ...)
What do you think ?

Well, it's an interesting idea... actually, the more I think about it the more it makes sense. One would have to have a high attack bonus to effectively use the feat, indicating that only one with skill and practice can use the weapon to its full potential. I like it.

[Silverleaf]

It does make sense, but what about Rohirrim Weapon Masters, or other people with the Expertise feat? It's quite a common one to take here at MERP. The spear should give bonuses to everyone.

[DM_Eönwë]

No feats on items!

[DM_Eönwë]

See this for more information.

[vulpex]

Not a bug as such, but it has been a rumour that good side could purchase +4 dex bracers once done with certain favours....
For now just the +2 sold, even if you have done quests.